I should start this post with a disclaimer: I have no strong feelings about Daniel Tosh. I know some of you reading this probably think he’s really funny, while some of you reading this think he’s an unfunny power tool. I don’t think he’s unfunny or funny — ever since bursting onto the scene a few short years ago I’ve always just considered him, well, there.
With that said, late yesterday afternoon a minor firestorm erupted over an incident involving Daniel Tosh and a woman who attended one of his standup shows last Friday night. According to the aforementioned woman’s account, Tosh launched into a lengthy stream of rape jokes, prompting her to criticize Tosh’s act from the audience. Things then got a little ugly, as can sometimes happens when you choose to heckle a comedian during a performance rather than just getting up and walking out.
After I called out to him, Tosh paused for a moment. Then, he says, “Wouldn’t it be funny if that girl got raped by like, 5 guys right now? Like right now? What if a bunch of guys just raped her…” and I, completely stunned and finding it hard to process what was happening but knowing i needed to get out of there, immediately nudged my friend, who was also completely stunned, and we high-tailed it out of there.
Tosh issued an apology last night via Twitter after the story began to spread, but that didn’t stop many from taking him to the woodshed. Meanwhile, some people, including the beloved Louis C.K., voiced support for Tosh and every comedian’s right to tell rape jokes.
So who’s right? Well, I think both sides have valid points here. First off, his standup material aside, Tosh reacted in an impossibly stupid and reckless way to criticism of his act. And I agree that rape, as well as all the other gazillion f*cked up things in life, should be fair game when it comes to finding humor in them. Laughter is the best remedy for emotional pain, after all.
But here’s the thing: Daniel Tosh should not be telling rape jokes EVER. Why? Because he still looks and acts like the guy at the frat house you’d go to if you wanted to obtain whatever it is a person needs to roofie someone, that’s why. I defy anyone to watch five minutes of Daniel Tosh’s show and not come away thinking that the guy could potentially date rape their sister.
Bottom line: nothing is off limits in the hands of a skilled comedian. Comics like Daniel Tosh who resemble date rapists, however, should refrain from telling rape jokes. Period.
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I think the girl’s reaction that she felt like the audience at a comedy club might have actually gang raped her was a bit over the top, but I also don’t feel bad for the “clever” comedian and his rape joke routine that he couldn’t wait to try out. Edgy used to mean something.
I miss the days when edgy meant something.
I’m not totally against rape jokes, but the problem is that a good 99% of them feel like Carlos Mencia-esque faux edginess.
I’m definitely not outraged by Tosh’s routine. I’m just upset that the guy who already had a rape joke routine felt he needed to go back and re-tap the well. I’d be just as upset if Aziz makes R. Kelly jokes a regular thing. Once? Awesome. Twice? Fine. Any more? We get it, R. Kelly is strange.
No, no, I agree. It feels simultaneously lazy and try-hard, like you’re more interested in being an edgy badass than being funny.
This girl gives herself away when she said she felt “provoked”, and “had to say something.” I hate her, and don’t think she deserved the kindness of being raped, unless it was by a swarm of bees in a dick shape like from Skate or Die.
And to try to sell the implication that she felt threatened, like the audience might actually rape her… confirms that she’s a drama queen looking for a victim’s spotlight no matter how absurd.
Anybody who opens their stupid mouth during a stand-up act should expect to be blasted with both barrels by the performer. Rape is not funny. I understand that. There is no reason to try to make it funny. Content aside, when there is a comedian on stage (and I understand that many people may have a hard time considering Tosh a comedian, but he does stand on a stage and tells jokes into a microphone in front of a room full of people) it is not a participatory event. You sit there, laugh or don’t, and when the show is over you are free to voice your opinion. The jokes may have been in bad taste, but interrupting the comic is just rude.
A good comedian can pull off a rape joke but, most of the time it seems forced
/waaaah waaaah
Yeah, I get what he was trying to do, irony, but probably not the best topic. On the other hand, if this girl is a Tosh fan should she really be shocked that he went that route when she heckled him?
Honestly, if I was her, I just would’ve left. But for him to call out an audience member like that, whether she was heckling him or not, is pretty crappy behavior and not at all funny.
A comedian has a duty to shut hecklers up. Hecklers are ignorant turds who need to be made to feel like ignorant turds. She had no right to attempt to ruin the show for anybody else. If you haven’t seen it, Patty, please watch season 1 of “Louie”. There is an episode that deals beautifully with this topic.
Y’know what? Good. Fuck that chick. Who give’s a shit if you find something offensive? That’s what she gets for feeling so fucking entitled that she feels like she “has” to say something. If you’re offended, get up and leave! She ruins the show for everyone else because she doesn’t know the difference between a joke and real life? Gimme a break. Keep your criticisms to twitter, where people give a crap.
You will be welcomed on my new island once the Earth is finally overrun by the offended.
jackpot!
I concur.
For the last time, RAPE JOKES AREN’T OFFENSIVE, THEY ARE DANGEROUS. Know what PTSD is? Talk to a Vietnam vet about it. When you have PTSD from rape (which usually happens), a rape joke can cause a flashback, which often leads to a panic attack. Having PTSD doesn’t make someone “offended.” It just means that you and others like you don’t understand the difference between being “offended” and having one’s own health compromised by people who don’t understand mental health issues.
Tosh should improve his act. There was a time when everyone thought Dane Cook was insane. Now he’s a running joke. Dane didn’t improve on his act and relied on the screaming fratboy douche thing even in his movies. Tosh risks the same. He’s got a weird homo-erotic but still cool to hang out with asshle-thing going on. He takes it to the edge, way too often. Try mixing it up, adding some subtlety to your act. Otherwise one day everyone is going wake up and realize they are tired of being yelled at by a confused anorexic.
no no no, you got it all wrong. Dane Cook is the fratboy with with a “heart of gold”… right up until he fucks you with a chainsaw or something.
Carlin once did a bit on how rape can be funny ([www.youtube.com]). It’s all dependent upon the context. This just seems like faux indignation from a heckler who would’ve done better to quietly leave if she was truly offended.
I have a feeling you’ve never been raped before, don’t have PTSD because of it, and aren’t at risk of having a flashback-induced panic attack due to a joke that others would find funny since they don’t understand the horror of it.
“I thought this was AMERICA!”
-Randy Marsh
FUGGNYEAH!
This is the last place I’d expect to find support for some butthurt cunt who couldn’t handle a comedy show.
Also, Cajun, no offense, but let’s look at your body of work, then Tosh’s. I’m not here touting him as the next coming of Richard Pryor or anything, but well, you’re a humorist of sorts, and he’s one of the better, most profitable, most active comedians in the business… and you occassionally have a good line on this website read by literally hundreds of people.
Ouch.
NEWSFLASH everyone: In AB’s world, if you’re not as well-known or as wealthy, as someone you do not have the right to be critical of that person.
I suppose under the same logic anyone who cooks has no right to walk out of Johnny Garlic’s and criticize Guy Fieri for serving them a shitty plate of pasta? And I suppose Vince at Filmdrunk has no right to ever write a review critical of a Tyler Perry movie, right? RIGHT?
And for the record, 2.4 million people visited this website in the past month, so it’s actually your comments that only get read by “literally hundreds of people.” So using your logic, who the fuck are you to be critical of me?
Hey Cajun, thanks for the update on the site traffic numbers, really helps your point.
I’m on team comedian with this one. Hecklers deserve whats coming to them if they interrupt a show like that so I have no sympathy for them regardless of how “Rapey” you think Tosh is.
Btw let me know when your new show on Comedy Central starts, I can’t wait to watch it.
Did you bother to read the post, Devil? I’m on the side of comedians as well. (“I agree that rape, as well as all the other gazillion f*cked up things in life, should be fair game when it comes to finding humor in them.”) Also, reference the post about Dave Chappelle being heckled in Austin last month I did.
Finally, can you not detect sarcasm at all? My saying Tosh shouldn’t do rape jokes because he looks rapey was obviously in jest.
Jesus.
Also, the “well you don’t have your own show on Comedy Central” argument is fucking retarded. Jeff Dunham and Carlos Mencia had their own shows on Comedy Central for fuck’s sake.
Cajun, by the same turn, A) don’t get so butthurt about that simple statement, I’d expect you to have thicker skin, and B) I was comparing you to Tosh simply because you impliedly said he wasn’t a skilled comedian. BAsically, a large portion of your thesis read as: Tosh isn’t funny enough to pull this off, and that he is “just, well there.” The guy is more than just there, he is one of the most successful, hardworking comedians in the business. The guy works constantly, is pretty funny most of the time, and has earned quite a bit of money and fame, all while insisting that selling comedy albums, yelling at people about taping or youtubing his shows, and all that other shit that most comedians bitch about, is just plain bullshit. He’s earned the right to do what he did, and has the credibility. He is not Michael Richards yelling “Nigger, nigger, nigger.” I thought that point needed to be added, and you have proven that it was necessary by your response.
Oh, so having a PTSD-related panic attack after hearing a rape joke means someone is “butthurt”? Because as a rape victim, that happened to me. Rape jokes aren’t “offensive.” They are DANGEROUS. They threaten people’s mental health.
I saw Tosh’s show a couple of months ago with the original rape joke included and–I’m sorry–he just executed it really well. It was a funny rape joke.
My feeling is that you’re not a rape victim.
“I defy anyone to watch five minutes of Daniel Tosh’s show and not come away thinking that the guy could potentially date rape their sister.”
I think that’s the whole “comic persona vs. actual personality” thing in a nutshell. Tosh has adopted that persona because it adds to his act, just like so many other comedians with their own personas. It’s not necessarily reflective of what he, or any comedian, truly thinks or feels.
The same thing happened to Patrice O’neal. Because of his show these sixteen year-old girls would come to his show only to be completely shocked about how is actual act is.
Also, you should check out the Patrice O’neal video: Patrice O’neal schools brawd on funny.
Didn’t Patrice O’Neal go to jail for sexual assault charges?
If I were Tosh, my rebuttal to this piece of shit would have been along these lines:
“Hey lady! Fuck you!”
What’s wrong with you??? Look up rape, PTSD, and flashback-induced panic attacks and THEN tell me that someone having panic attack because of rape memories is just “offended.” Rape jokes are dangerous; they aren’t offensive.
Did you know 5/6 people enjoy gang rape?
She said rape jokes were never going to be funny to her so obviously the show wasn’t for her. Censoring people for things you don’t like is a dumb ideal. Comedians tell terrible jokes about tame subjects too and Tosh can tell some terrible jokes sometimes, no matter the subject. Next time stick to Brian Regan or don’t see a random comic if you have specific tastes.
Rape jokes aren’t offensive. They are dangerous. Rape victims tend to have PTSD, and rape jokes cause flashbacks which can cause panic attacks. To imply that having PTSD and reacting to it means you’re “offended” seems to greatly diminish the pain that rape victims face.
Why did this woman even pay to see his show anyway? It’s not like he’s Bob Saget and his standup performance is radically different from the rest of the body of his work. What kinds of jokes was she expecting? It’s like going to a concert of a well known band and booing because you don’t like the music. Agree that if she didnt like it, she could have left without ruining it for everyone else.
Then you don’t understand what PTSD and flashbacks are. You should look those up before defending rape jokes as “freedom of speech.”
I will never understand someone who goes to a comedy club and is shocked that something offensive is said. For me, offensive content just sets the bar higher; if you’re going to do an offensive joke, it had better be funny, or else you look desperate to be edgy and controversial (lame.)
Then you don’t understand what PTSD and flashbacks are. You should look those up before defending rape jokes as “freedom of speech.” This isn’t about being “offensive,” but compromising one’s mental health for the sake of a joke that everyone can laugh at except rape victims, who are instead sitting in their seats with a shiver running up their spine at best, or having a flashback-induced panic attack at worst.
It is as simple as this: Tosh is getting raked over the coals because the alleged jokes and response to the, I guess a heckle, just weren’t funny at all. If a comedian is gonna delve into sensitive topics such as rape, incest, race, poverty, child abuse, and Hank Williams Jr., then the bits had better be KILLER funny. Otherwise, you’re just being a real dick up there. Again, it’s hard to say, “It was just a joke,” when no one finds it funny.
And I am 100% in agreement with Cajun here, in that from whence the joke came is a big factor in how this whole dust-up is being perceived. If a woman made those jokes: different story, obviously. A white dude cannot do Chris Rock style jokes on race; if he tries to, he had better be a funny as vintage Eddie Murphy, or he’s gonna get the groans.
I’m something of a new comedian, and I am acutely aware of how certain topics just wouldn’t play well coming from a 6’3″, good-looking white guy. I take great care to avoid coming off as anything close to racist or misogynistic, because I feel that, even if the jokes are funny, they’ll come of as sort of douchey from a guy like me (again, I’m physically more Daniel Tosh than Dave Attell). Also, my-wife-won’t-bang-me/i-can’t-get-laid jokes don’t really play (still plenty of beating-off-to-internet-porn). Instead I focus some of my act on self-deprecation over the fact that my good physical fortune has rendered me a skill-less gigolo, with only one client, my wife.
Moral of the story: Know thy audience; know thyself.
Yep, you probably should be judging how funny bits you didn’t see were.
Oh, and you should definitely give advice to guys with better than a decade of experience and great success on how to the job they’ve been doing. Probably 60% ish of Tosh’s routine is mysoginistic, and he’s made a lot of people laugh doing it.
How’d I miss this barrel-o-fun post? Dang, I like to jump in while things are still hopin’. Oh well.
Rape jokes CAN be funny. Witness Louis CK’s joke (Paraphrasing): I don’t believe in rape, except if she doesn’t want to have sex with me. Why does this work? Because it’s Louis CK and you know him, you’re in a comedy club, and he’s not hinting that anyone in the audience be attacked.
I’ve seen Tosh.0. While I think he’s likely a douche, I’ve laughed despite myself. I enjoy that there are people pushing the envelope of political correctness.
Tosh blew it. If he’d said to a man of color in the audience, “Wouldn’t it be funny if they strung you up” or to someone Jewish, “Wouldn’t it be funny if they hauled you off to a camp right now” there would be no doubt about crossing the line.
There are plenty of things you can’t say on stage; one of them is anything that sounds like a direction to harm others, even in jest. I’m more on the “Let the jokes fly” side of comedy than most people, but I also have common sense and know CONTEXT. I don’t show up for a job interview in an ironic t-shirt, I don’t go to a bank with rolls of quarters strapped to my chest like sticks of dynamite. There are things you can say in your living room with friends that you can’t say in public. Your friends understand you, and about 10% of strangers will fully get you right off the bat. In a comedy club, a celebrity is more likely to hit 90%, but there’s still 10% who are going to get it wrong.
How has that not been a comedy skit before?… A guy shows up at a bank to turn in his savings in quarters, but they’re wrapped up in rolls and taped to his chest like sticks of dynamite and doesn’t get why everyone is freaking out. I just made that up. Trademark Homo_Erectus 2012.
Great post! Great bit too.
I, too, was late to this party. [awkwardly mills about, looks up at the only other dude in the room] And I also think that Tosh can be pretty funny; the dude has damn good timing.
There is no spoon… I mean line.
Holocaust and hangin jokes can be funny too. Nothing is off limits. It’s all a matter of personal taste, which is… um… personal, not general.
I still can’t believe this is being discussed on a “comedy” site like there is any question. Also, I’ve seen accounts from other people in the audience who thought A) the initial joke was funny, and B) the response to her interruption was fucking hilarious. Thus, it worked. Anything that doesn’t turn the whole audience against you in a comedy routine is ok.
I feel like the internet should worry less about the rape joke he made and more about why his face is so creepy. He looks like a character from Davey and Goliath.
Whatever happened to Freeh Speech, anyway?
dafuq is this AB guy? He seems like a total ball bag. I bet it’s actually Tosh.
I strongly disagree with the implication that making rape jokes is about free speech. What makes rape jokes so very different from race jokes and sexism jokes is that rape jokes can TRIGGER SOMEONE WITH PTSD. If someone reacts negatively to a rape joke, it doesn’t mean they are “offended.” It can mean that their own mental health is compromised. PTSD flashbacks are nothing to scoff at; many Vietnam vets can vouch for that. Also, as a rape victim myself I have to point out; neither I not any of the other rape victims I know in group find comedy a good way to lessen rape for us. Making comedy out of rape makes it more painful. I have literally heard rape jokes before that caused me to flashback and then I had a panic attack.
All of you who think tosh is wrong, it would be funny if five dudes raped you! Right now! I’m sorry but he’s a comedian, he is trying to get laughs. Does he hope you are actually raped? No. I don’t either. He is trying to get laughs off a pain in the ass, stuck up audience member who derailed his show when she thought he would only say PC; family friendly shit like he’s Jim Nabors. This is no different than being offended by a Bill Hicks bit if you’re a christian. If you are “offended” by a comedian, then leave or be ready when he/she makes fun of you for interrupting their show, you moron. If you are the type who is moderately offended by things, either say home or at church on Sundays. Grow some balls America, we have become a nation of girly men and cry babies.
Avocado: This offends me so it’s wrong! From my moral high horse, you are all meanies. How dare you!
Get over yourself doichebag.
Douchebag.
Sorry, I meant to call avocado a douchebag, not a doichebag. Because avocado seems a tad douchey, not doichey.